Post by Arun Nagrath on Jun 29, 2011 18:34:48 GMT
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Hi there, I haven't been on this site very often of late, but I have just received my TMAU Test results which were done at Sheffield Children's Hospital, UK, by ordering my test through smartnutrition.co.uk.
It looks like I might have TMAU2?
Trimethylamine (TMA) * 17.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range
2.5-10.8)
TMA-n-Oxide * 530.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range 17.0-147.0)
TMA/TMA-n-Oxide * 0.03 (Reference range 0.05-0.21)
Urine creatinine 9.0 mmol/L
It looks like TMAU primary is a no then?, and I may have TMAU according to the explanation which they provided.... What happens now? I will take these to my doc, and see what she says. Is it possible for these results to be higher than normal because I ate a huge choline load the night before - like loads of eggs, bacon and beans for a few days straight actually, or maybe something else causing it other than TMAU2?
I look forward to hearing from you guys.
#2
1 Week Ago
Sharon
Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 230
Blog Entries: 9
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Alf or Arun can formulate the numbers better than I can but they all look off. How long did it take to get your results back?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rr30
Hi there, I haven't been on this site very often of late, but I have just received my TMAU Test results which were done at Sheffield Children's Hospital, UK, by ordering my test through smartnutrition.co.uk.
It looks like I might have TMAU2?
Trimethylamine (TMA) * 17.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range
2.5-10.8)
TMA-n-Oxide * 530.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range 17.0-147.0)
TMA/TMA-n-Oxide * 0.03 (Reference range 0.05-0.21)
Urine creatinine 9.0 mmol/L
It looks like TMAU primary is a no then?, and I may have TMAU according to the explanation which they provided.... What happens now? I will take these to my doc, and see what she says. Is it possible for these results to be higher than normal because I ate a huge choline load the night before - like loads of eggs, bacon and beans for a few days straight actually, or maybe something else causing it other than TMAU2?
I look forward to hearing from you guys.
#3
6 Days Ago
Jax.the.Max
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: MIAMI
Posts: 86
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Ok... so what is the difference between TMAU and TMAU2?
#4
6 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jax.the.Max
Ok... so what is the difference between TMAU and TMAU2?
TMAU2 is secondary, TMAU is primary... from what I understand I have had something which has caused an imbalance in a particular bacteria, and there is some sort of overgrowth of this, which produces TMA hence the odor. It would make a lot of sense because it is based in the intestines I believe and I have had food poisoning in the past which led to this, however I think nobody knows exactly what causes it. TMAU on the other hand is primary, it is genetic, you either have it or you don't, and usually becomes apparent in childhood or the teen years.
I am wanting to know from people who are a bit more knowledgeable about this topic than I am (haven't read too much into it), if there is a chance my result could be a "false" positive, due to something else such as a UTI or another problem? I will book into see my doctor next week, she doesn't know I arranged this test, though I hope those along with Nigel Manning's contact number, and the sugegstion of antibiotics followed by probiotics will get things moving.
#5
6 Days Ago
Alf
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 68
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Hi,
My amateur reading is that it does look like a TMAU2 case.
Your TMA + TMAO total is very high, suggesting a bacterial overgrowth.
But you oxidized most of the TMA to TMAO (97% ?) so your enzyme looks to be functioning pretty good.
You were still left with 17.3 which is higher than Sheffield's upper limit of 10.8, so you are predicted to possibly have a TMA smell issue
The big choline meals could have skewed the result a bit but it does seem the bacteria is there ready to be fed at anytime.
I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though, but in the end you did this test and it says you were TMAU2
#6
6 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
Hi,
My amateur reading is that it does look like a TMAU2 case.
Your TMA + TMAO total is very high, suggesting a bacterial overgrowth.
But you oxidized most of the TMA to TMAO (97% ?) so your enzyme looks to be functioning pretty good.
You were still left with 17.3 which is higher than Sheffield's upper limit of 10.8, so you are predicted to possibly have a TMA smell issue
The big choline meals could have skewed the result a bit but it does seem the bacteria is there ready to be fed at anytime.
I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though, but in the end you did this test and it says you were TMAU2
Hi Alf, thanks very much for your reply. What do you mean exactly by "I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though" ?
What does my second result of 530.3 umol/mmol mean, am I right in thinking it is the TMA which has been oxidised, and this part of it doesn't smell at all, so shouldn't be that worried about that causing an odor? It is the TMA of 17.3which is the one which causes odor right?
Also, I have another question, I had more than one "choline load meal" - maybe fore a couple of days before providing a sample - beans, eggs, bacon and red meat over two days - is there a possiblity I over do it giving e a false result?
I have just tried to contact Nigel Manning on the number provided and he is on annual leave until the end of next week, hence all these questions.....
#7
4 Days Ago
Alf
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 68
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
#8
3 Days Ago
suzuki
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: cobh
Posts: 15
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
100% agree
#9
3 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
Thanks for the reply Alf. I have actually been reading that a UTI could have caused more TMA and suchlike, so effect the result, which is extremely interesting as I have had a recurrent UTI over the past few months, and it may have been tnhe case when I provided the sample! Surely they should have tested for that?
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Hi there, I haven't been on this site very often of late, but I have just received my TMAU Test results which were done at Sheffield Children's Hospital, UK, by ordering my test through smartnutrition.co.uk.
It looks like I might have TMAU2?
Trimethylamine (TMA) * 17.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range
2.5-10.8)
TMA-n-Oxide * 530.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range 17.0-147.0)
TMA/TMA-n-Oxide * 0.03 (Reference range 0.05-0.21)
Urine creatinine 9.0 mmol/L
It looks like TMAU primary is a no then?, and I may have TMAU according to the explanation which they provided.... What happens now? I will take these to my doc, and see what she says. Is it possible for these results to be higher than normal because I ate a huge choline load the night before - like loads of eggs, bacon and beans for a few days straight actually, or maybe something else causing it other than TMAU2?
I look forward to hearing from you guys.
#2
1 Week Ago
Sharon
Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 230
Blog Entries: 9
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Alf or Arun can formulate the numbers better than I can but they all look off. How long did it take to get your results back?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rr30
Hi there, I haven't been on this site very often of late, but I have just received my TMAU Test results which were done at Sheffield Children's Hospital, UK, by ordering my test through smartnutrition.co.uk.
It looks like I might have TMAU2?
Trimethylamine (TMA) * 17.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range
2.5-10.8)
TMA-n-Oxide * 530.3 umol/mmol creat (Reference range 17.0-147.0)
TMA/TMA-n-Oxide * 0.03 (Reference range 0.05-0.21)
Urine creatinine 9.0 mmol/L
It looks like TMAU primary is a no then?, and I may have TMAU according to the explanation which they provided.... What happens now? I will take these to my doc, and see what she says. Is it possible for these results to be higher than normal because I ate a huge choline load the night before - like loads of eggs, bacon and beans for a few days straight actually, or maybe something else causing it other than TMAU2?
I look forward to hearing from you guys.
#3
6 Days Ago
Jax.the.Max
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: MIAMI
Posts: 86
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Ok... so what is the difference between TMAU and TMAU2?
#4
6 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jax.the.Max
Ok... so what is the difference between TMAU and TMAU2?
TMAU2 is secondary, TMAU is primary... from what I understand I have had something which has caused an imbalance in a particular bacteria, and there is some sort of overgrowth of this, which produces TMA hence the odor. It would make a lot of sense because it is based in the intestines I believe and I have had food poisoning in the past which led to this, however I think nobody knows exactly what causes it. TMAU on the other hand is primary, it is genetic, you either have it or you don't, and usually becomes apparent in childhood or the teen years.
I am wanting to know from people who are a bit more knowledgeable about this topic than I am (haven't read too much into it), if there is a chance my result could be a "false" positive, due to something else such as a UTI or another problem? I will book into see my doctor next week, she doesn't know I arranged this test, though I hope those along with Nigel Manning's contact number, and the sugegstion of antibiotics followed by probiotics will get things moving.
#5
6 Days Ago
Alf
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 68
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Hi,
My amateur reading is that it does look like a TMAU2 case.
Your TMA + TMAO total is very high, suggesting a bacterial overgrowth.
But you oxidized most of the TMA to TMAO (97% ?) so your enzyme looks to be functioning pretty good.
You were still left with 17.3 which is higher than Sheffield's upper limit of 10.8, so you are predicted to possibly have a TMA smell issue
The big choline meals could have skewed the result a bit but it does seem the bacteria is there ready to be fed at anytime.
I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though, but in the end you did this test and it says you were TMAU2
#6
6 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
Hi,
My amateur reading is that it does look like a TMAU2 case.
Your TMA + TMAO total is very high, suggesting a bacterial overgrowth.
But you oxidized most of the TMA to TMAO (97% ?) so your enzyme looks to be functioning pretty good.
You were still left with 17.3 which is higher than Sheffield's upper limit of 10.8, so you are predicted to possibly have a TMA smell issue
The big choline meals could have skewed the result a bit but it does seem the bacteria is there ready to be fed at anytime.
I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though, but in the end you did this test and it says you were TMAU2
Hi Alf, thanks very much for your reply. What do you mean exactly by "I am also not sure that TMAU explains the range of smells even in TMAU cases though" ?
What does my second result of 530.3 umol/mmol mean, am I right in thinking it is the TMA which has been oxidised, and this part of it doesn't smell at all, so shouldn't be that worried about that causing an odor? It is the TMA of 17.3which is the one which causes odor right?
Also, I have another question, I had more than one "choline load meal" - maybe fore a couple of days before providing a sample - beans, eggs, bacon and red meat over two days - is there a possiblity I over do it giving e a false result?
I have just tried to contact Nigel Manning on the number provided and he is on annual leave until the end of next week, hence all these questions.....
#7
4 Days Ago
Alf
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 68
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
#8
3 Days Ago
suzuki
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: cobh
Posts: 15
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
100% agree
#9
3 Days Ago
rr30
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW England
Posts: 76
Re: My TMAU Test Results (via BioLab/SmartNutrition.co.uk)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf
All I mean is that perhaps TMAU is all that is on offer for diagnosis of systemic body odors and perhaps it doesn't explain the root cause in cases. This is an opinion and not anything to do with your result.
Yes the 530 is oxidized TMA and it means your FMO3 enzyme did well. But it means the enzyme was presented with a lot of TMA from your gut.
You might have been overdoing the choline load but you probably do that in the normal diet anyhow. The bacteria is there waiting to be fed at any time anyhow. Normal people only produce maybe 150 TMAO maximum (according to Sheffields upper limit) meaning they have less bacteria in their gut than you.
Thanks for the reply Alf. I have actually been reading that a UTI could have caused more TMA and suchlike, so effect the result, which is extremely interesting as I have had a recurrent UTI over the past few months, and it may have been tnhe case when I provided the sample! Surely they should have tested for that?